PicklesPickles's Journal, 30 September 2016

Awesome post  

"Obesity: The Post Mortem" -- has put something in me that I hope never goes away. I will watch it over and over again, to point of obsessive if necessary, to remember this has almost nothing to do with how good/bad I look on the outside.  

So, you are saying that I'm fat because I chose to get Plantar Fasciitis and I chose to have doctors who wouldn't treat it other than to say I need to lose weight, despite the fact that when I came down with it I was over 100 pounds lighter than I am now and I that I choose to be in so much excruciating pain that I could barely get around for two years while I was trying to find a doctor that would actually treat the condition? 

I have morton's neuroma. Yes, I'm fat because of the food choices I make. Not because of an issue with my foot. I'm only lying to myself if I blame it on the tumor that is in the ball of my foot because there are many ways for me to take care of health.  

Dr. Jason Fung has something to say about always blaming the patient for everything. The doctors are trained to treat obesity in a certain way that makes things worse and not better. I agree that we shouldn't blame others for our bad food choices. But I don't like "all or nothing" thinking when it comes to root causes. And as far as "Fat Acceptance" - I don't agree we should celebrate being fat but I also don't think we should label people who are as "lazy, stupid, dirty" or discriminate against people who are fat. Fat is a condition that doesn't have to be permanent - it has nothing to do with someone's soul. 

In my experience, many people need treatments similar to addicts. I've found quitting the junk food harder than when I quit smoking. I realized this the day, and it's burned in my mind, I walked passed someone with a bag of Doritos. I then couldn't concentrate, work or focus on anything until I gave in and bought a bag of Doritos. I agree, having a doctor telling some obese people to eat an apple instead of a cake is like telling a crackhead to smoke a cigarette instead of hitting the pipe. And just like an addict, accepting the reality of it, and the work and difficulty it will take to beat it, needs to be recognized.... not lying to ourselves..  

Thanks NYSHELLY! 

I agree with the addict problem, and as a former 30 year binge eater I read the book Rational Recovery to stop. It is a book for alcoholics and drug addicts. It was the only thing that helped me quit. I have not had a full fledge binge since July. I have skirted it a few times and overeaten but not one of those "out of body experience" eat everything in the cupboard binges. 

This is true. I look at drug addicts, alcoholics, and others with the same lack of discipline, self-harm... and yes, weakness.... as I do with us as obese people. I've said before and will again, it's something I didn't anticipate when I gained all the weight and now trying to lose it - how very similar the addictions feel when trying to quit food, as when I quit smoking. I do feel a bit of empathy, because I know how difficult it is, but ultimately, it has to be done... and can be done. 

I don't agree with "lack of discipline"...there are doctors that smoke and are obese. They don't have lack of discipline - it took lots of it to get through Med School. I have a lot of discipline but I didn't have the right perspective on how to think about the problem. You keep wanting to label the problem as a singular failure of a person's character to make it simple but these things aren't just simple problems. If it was I would have lost weight 30 years ago with one shot. It took 30 years for me to come to the right framework. It is an unfortunate loss of time and waste of a lot of my good moments but I can't do anything about it now except do good things with the time I have left and move forward. 

I'm sure that it would make thousands of fatties happy to be socially accepted as they are and continue to grow to be. Thing is, diabetes and heart disease suck. And guess what? Thin people are still considered to be the most attractive and most desired for love and work. Healthy = low maintenance, more fun, youthful. I think "Fat Acceptance" is just a PR move, like saying to a guy that "Size doesn't matter." 

I agree with Ny_shelly that there is an oversimplification here. In addition to that the acceptance movement might just be about not making fun of people who don't fit into what society has said the ideal body type is. I do agree with you too OP that there is some personal responsibility that needs to be taken. There just needs to be less judgement all around.  

One thing that would help is if our healthcare system included incentives for being within a certain body fat range (BMI is a joke). If you have traffic tickets and accidents, you pay more for auto insurance. If you are a smoker, you pay more for life insurance. Being overweight or obese creates as many health issues as smoking. I would like to see preferred rates for people that take personal responsibility for their health and maintain a normal body fat percentage. It will never happen because it is not PC. Such a system would offend someone, be labelled discriminatory, and be crushed before it ever really got off the ground. Moreover, such a system would be heavily contested by the drug companies and physician lobby. Much more profitable to have a large population of overweight/obese people that require a steady stream of drugs and doctor visits to stay alive. 

that comment was hillarious mike. get rewards for being healthy! really! lol. 

@Arabella - Of course my journal is about how I feel about my situation. This is why it's in my journal.... Obesity is never healthy and anyone who doesn't think so is merely deluding themselves. I agree, it doesn't matter how someone got to that point. What matters is that they get it off. We have to take responsibility for ourselves, how we got this way, and what we're doing to get rid of it. Yes, Thin means thin but it does mean that this thin person isn't also attributing to their bad health by being obese. Thin people get the same diseases that obese people do this is true... It's nice to live in a fantasy world, believing that simply because we're obese, we're in no more danger than a thin person, but I can't lie to myself like that....  

@Arabella: I live in Southern California (land of size 2), and my post was about "Fat Acceptance" being a joke - a public relations campaign sponsored by Pillsbury. In most cases, fat people are obese because of sloth and gluttony. Their social activities revolve around food events shared with other fat people, rather than on physical activities/sports (here people run, surf, cycle together year-round); the fatties stuff their faces while watching the game, the skinnies PLAY the game. In both groups, they are doing what is Socially Acceptable for their weight. And yet, thin people are more likely to be hired, men are more attracted to thin women. Size doesn't matter? It matters. 

Arabella.. It seems that you're blaming your inability to control your emotions on my statements. I'm not telling anyone how to feel. I'm saying we all have to take responsibility for the situation we have put ourselves in. So what if the fat isn't from Cheetos. It's certainly not from exercising too much or getting too much activity. At this moment, right now, I don't care how the journey to be fat started. Because it doesn't matter. I can blame it on a foot ailment. I can make excuses about my job, my kids, my family... But none of that matters... What matters is that now, at this moment in time, I am overweight. And that's what is not acceptable and has to change... Not hiring me because I'm fat? If the fat acceptance movement actually were about intelligence and ability, then there wouldn't be this need for obese women to consider 'confidence' as posing half-naked on social media. 

@iloveoliver - This is true. We can only be shamed if we feel ashamed. I wont' say that insults wouldn't bother me at all if it were to happen. But SELF is where Self-Esteem comes from. I know what my faults are, and I know where my strengths are. A stranger's opinion of me holds no value. Ain't no shame in my game... as they say ;)  

Thin people are more likely to be hired because they APPEAR to be healthier, and healthy = fewer sick days, lower health insurance premiums. These same bosses want nonsmokers for the exact same reason. And in an interview, first impressions are all you've got. Given the choice between two candidates with similar work experience and education, the thin person will win. No amount of complaining about how this isn't fair is not going to change reality. 

It also resonates with me and it's not because I'm ashamed of being fat. I mean, I used to be, but it was really not that I was fat, it was that I wasn't doing anything about it. I knew there was a problem that was impacting my health, happiness, and so much more, and I was doing nothing to rectify the problem. That filled me with shame and when I was approaching 300 lbs (which was 9 years ago now) I was in a really dark place. Now I'm doing stuff about it, I am working towards fixing the problem, and have the data to prove that what I am doing is working, so I have no shame about it anymore. Am I taking my sweet time? Yes, absolutely. But I am doing the right thing and am I on track to be truly, doctor-approved "healthy" / truly happy with myself after two more years? Yes! Do I still feel shame when I f##k up and binge on junkfood which still happens every now and again? Yes. But I don't feel shame all day, every day, at every meal, every time I see myself in a mirror, everytime I have to walk up a flight of stairs, etc. anymore. Part of me is actually starting to feel .. gasp.. Pride. Pride at how far I have come. I hate the fat acceptance movement for the same reason @Pickles does: because I think it is dangerous. Morbidly obese people (which I was!) need to realize they have a serious health problem and that they need to take steps to work on it. (Obviously, individuals with an actual, relevant health condition are special cases and do not necessarily fall into this umbrella. I am not talking about those people.) Baby steps are fine, but they have to be seriously doing SOMETHING about it. Pickles post says basically that, and that is probably what resonates with @kpw as well. Not that I mean to speak for you, @kpw. The idea is that the movement, or at least a significant subset of it, is trying to push the message of "Being morbidly obese is 100% fine and not a health issue." which is a downright lie and will literally shorten the lifespan of those who adopt that mentality. The fact that there are morbidly obese people at home, living a 99% sedentary lifestyle, eating an entire bag of Oreos as just a light snack, eating 5000 empty calories a day, then seeing all this fat acceptance propaganda, plus sized model glamorization, so on and so on, then telling themselves "Cool, this is fine, people have to accept my lifestyle now and there is not a problem with my current course of action" makes me feel so sad. In the same way we should not *encourage* smoking, alcoholism, opioid / drug abuse addictions, and so many other things that will most certainly decrease your lifespan, we should not *encourage* obesity. Now, to clarify, I absolutely love and support the *good* parts of the movement, which are mostly "Fat and yes, even morbidly obese people, should be treated with the same respect as healthy people and not be publicly shamed." And the push against truly insane health standards in media and stuff. Those are fantastic things to work towards and deserving of huge respect, but that is not the part of the movement that is dangerous / that is being discussed here.