Thermodynamics? Not really...

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eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 19 Jul 2013, 22:09
Diablo360x wrote:
Herpaderp, it is a combo punch of awesome. Can we agree there? If you're on a LC diet you are either high fat or high protein as well. Lettuce beef cereal here.

Sorry, but a LC diet is no more likely to be high protein than a low fat diet is. In both cases the protein macro is independent of the source of the energy calories.

I could draw up a daily menu plan to show you. Or you could just reverse the numbers on the plan you designed.

Enjoy your lettuce-and-beef cereal.
Diablo360x

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 816

      quote  
Posted: 19 Jul 2013, 22:13
Ok electronic Katherine, lettuce beef cereal, if you're low carb, one of the other two macros will be high or at least moderate unless you're going really low on calories. I don't think Low carbers aim at any particular macro goals so one day may be high Protein while another is high fat. Happy?
Love your food or risk failure. No quick fixes, this is a lifestyle change. No extremes are needed just consistency.
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 19 Jul 2013, 22:40
Low carb is a high fat diet. If you were to listen in on low carb forums, you would hear experienced people telling newbies not to eat so much protein, because "low carb is not a high protein diet."

reddarin

Joined: Nov 11
Posts: 959

      quote  
Posted: 19 Jul 2013, 22:44
Putting up a photo of the body you'd like to have is a very old motivational technique. It is old because it works so well.

Doctoring it with your own face over the photo just helps make it more real to you for motivation. More 'present tense' as it were, for more impact. Goals are you can see clearly in your mind are much more real to you.

It even has a name: visualization.
mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 07:27
eKatherine wrote:
Low carb is a high fat diet. If you were to listen in on low carb forums, you would hear experienced people telling newbies not to eat so much protein, because "low carb is not a high protein diet."



Yup.

Gluconeogenesis.
mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 07:29
Diablo360x wrote:
Herpaderp, it is a combo punch of awesome. Can we agree there? If you're on a LC diet you are either high fat or high protein as well.


No.
mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 08:01
eKatherine wrote:
If LC works by restricting calories, and it makes no difference how a dieter restricts those calories, then why are the CICO fans so opposed to it? Being right for the wrong reason is still being right.


That is THE key question anyone has asked in this entire thread and all the others like it.

I've maintained from the get-go that these anti-LC fanatics smell strongly of an ulterior motive behind their incessant hostility and invincible ignorance. Either they're die-hard trolls who won't bother with Weight Watchers b/c WW doesn't give consistent results worth arguing over, and informed LC does...or...despite their geared-up gymboy avatars, they're really closet vegans who hate "meat murderers."

Or they're just psychotic sock puppets of the same guy.

Whatever it is, there's more here than meets the eye, and eKatherine nailed it.
mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 08:07
You know what would fix this problem forever? If the powers that be at FS installed a Ignore function.

Perhaps we should all request it, whichever side of this issue we're on.

Diablo - you up for seeing an Ignore button installed?
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 09:09
An ignore button would only work if trolls didn't create new member accounts to harass people.
reddarin

Joined: Nov 11
Posts: 959

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Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 09:51
What is striking is that the guy(s) that are so dead sure that LC is wrong don't know a thing about what they are saying is wrong. Diablo proves it every single time he describes LC. All they know is they are 'right'.

mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 11:46
eKatherine wrote:
An ignore button would only work if trolls didn't create new member accounts to harass people.


True, short of FS blocking them permanently, it's a stop-gap measure. But they're always so repetitive/obsessive, they're easy to spot and ignore, no matter how many sock puppet logins they create.

Right, Space?

I guess I was thinking more of an "Ignore User" function than a simple "Ignore this post."
mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 11:52
reddarin wrote:
What is striking is that the guy(s) that are so dead sure that LC is wrong don't know a thing about what they are saying is wrong. Diablo proves it every single time he describes LC. All they know is they are 'right'.


It's not that they want to be right. They have no intellectual integrity. If they did, they'd listen and accept , if grudgingly, the testimony of those who say LC works SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE it's LC, not because of incidental caloric reduction. That's what a rational person would do.

But since they don't care about anything anyone says, it tells me they have another axe to grind that they aren't showing because, if they did, we'd write them off forever as closed-minded, agenda-driven drones (which I suspect he/she/they are) or simply die-hard, truly misanthropic and probably schizophrenic trolls who don't actually care about any diet but just want the attention.

Anyway, an Ignore User function would fix this forever...the only way you'd see their comments is if someone you're not ignoring quotes them.

You'd be okay with that, right Diablo?
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 12:29
mmoodd69 wrote:
reddarin wrote:
What is striking is that the guy(s) that are so dead sure that LC is wrong don't know a thing about what they are saying is wrong. Diablo proves it every single time he describes LC. All they know is they are 'right'.


It's not that they want to be right. They have no intellectual integrity. If they did, they'd listen and accept , if grudgingly, the testimony of those who say LC works SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE it's LC, not because of incidental caloric reduction. That's what a rational person would do.

But since they don't care about anything anyone says, it tells me they have another axe to grind that they aren't showing because, if they did, we'd write them off forever as closed-minded, agenda-driven drones (which I suspect he/she/they are) or simply die-hard, truly misanthropic and probably schizophrenic trolls who don't actually care about any diet but just want the attention.


It's not that they want to be right. It's that they need to be right on this.

The fact is that most people are irrationally attached to their way of eating, whether they grew up with it or gradually acquired it as adults, or see it as something that they had to choose to reach their health or physique goals. A person's diet (not necessarily "weight-loss diet" here) is so deep below the surface that they simply cannot question it. There is something very primal about diet in that way.

That's why so many people who are gluten-free get challenged constantly by people who think life wouldn't be worth living if they had to go without pizza and burgers. They feel like their way of life is being threatened by people who choose not to live the same way, even though the diet they actually eat may be very limited, not particularly healthy or nutritious, and quite new on the cultural timescale. Things people used to commonly eat only a century ago seem alien and un-American to them.

I see the same arguments being used here that I see used against giving up gluten - that giving up gluten is too restrictive, too hard, and it is unhealthy to give up an entire food group.

It's like trying to have a discussion with someone who learned in high school that Latin is the perfect language, and has set as their mission in life to make English more like Latin by encouraging other people to speak a version of Modern English that has been modified to be more like Latin. When you speak with them, they are constantly "correcting" you by trying to get you to stop using certain English grammar and vocabulary words, to use instead awkward-sounding Latin syntax and words derived from Latin and used to mean what they think they ought to mean. Then they speak and you have to think to figure out what they are trying to communicate, because what they said has no real meaning in English as it is spoken.
reddarin

Joined: Nov 11
Posts: 959

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 12:39
And!!! Carbohydrate = glucose = sugar.

In the end the mainstream is insisting that you keep your sugar intake up in the name of being 'well-balanced'.

How many times has it come down to Diablo taunting us/me over being able to eat totally crap food like pizza, donuts and ice cream?

*That* is a plus? Oh goody, I can eat terrible food and feel good about myself because it is on-plan.

Pizza, donuts and ice cream got me to 265. Not eating pizza, donuts and ice cream got me to 185. Simple as that.

If I didn't say I was LC but simply said I stopped eating 'junk' food, which I have, I'd be hailed as an example of a mainstream ELMM WB success story.
mmoodd69

Joined: Jul 13
Posts: 126

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 13:19
eKatherine,

What's the difference (if any) between wheat allergy and people who avoid gluten? I now get a runny nose when I eat wheat, so I think I have a problem there, but have no idea what the gluten thing is all about.
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 13:43
mmoodd69 wrote:
eKatherine,

What's the difference (if any) between wheat allergy and people who avoid gluten? I now get a runny nose when I eat wheat, so I think I have a problem there, but have no idea what the gluten thing is all about.


Whether a reaction is an allergy has to do with the type of antibodies your body produces in response to the trigger food. A runny nose is definitely an allergic reaction to some component of the wheat that you are sensitive to. You may, however, still be able to consume rye, barley, and certain other gluten-containing grains related to wheat, like spelt, emmer, or einkorn.

The gluten intolerance response is to protein fragments of digesting gluten. It is an autoimmune response that causes issues in many parts of the body as the body's antibodies attack its own tissues.

Here's an article on symptoms of gluten intolerance.

Note that a person with celiac has a typical atrophy of villi cells in the upper intestine. They may also have any or all of the other symptoms shown as for gluten intolerance.

Many people stop eating wheat after discovering that it is causing their symptoms. It makes them sick, but they never bother with getting a medical diagnosis, since the treatment is the same with or without that diagnosis: stop eating gluten.

Some people give up eating gluten despite the fact that they have no symptoms of gluten intolerance, believing it is healthier or may help them lose weight. Statistically speaking, a certain percentage of this group will have latent or silent celiac. Some will also find that symptoms on the list that they didn't think were related to their diet clear up.

Many people who give up gluten end up eating commercially-available substitutes for baked goods, pasta, etc. They are substituting one slightly more processed food for another, which isn't a healthier diet. It can still be healthier than the standard American diet, which is high in junk food and fast food and low in fruits and vegetables.
reddarin

Joined: Nov 11
Posts: 959

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 15:07
I've also read that the tests for Celiac's and Crohn's are easy to misinterpret as negative.
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 15:40
reddarin wrote:
I've also read that the tests for Celiac's and Crohn's are easy to misinterpret as negative.


That's true, there are lots of false negatives. Even the biopsy depends to a great extent on luck and the skill of the doctor doing it.
reddarin

Joined: Nov 11
Posts: 959

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 17:40
Yeah, I considered getting tested because the results from going wheat-free were so spectacular, but no matter what the tests said I'd still stay wheat-free so no need to put myself through the rigmarole. Particularly since the tests are not entirely accurate.

Smile
Diablo360x

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 816

      quote  
Posted: 20 Jul 2013, 23:22
reddarin wrote:
What is striking is that the guy(s) that are so dead sure that LC is wrong don't know a thing about what they are saying is wrong. Diablo proves it every single time he describes LC. All they know is they are 'right'.



The only wrong I see is telling people they burn more calories on LC. I already said all diets are viable. You do have to have a deficit maintenance or surplus depending on your goals is all. Keep it up everyone.
Love your food or risk failure. No quick fixes, this is a lifestyle change. No extremes are needed just consistency.



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