‎"Americans are fat and sick because they eat too much and don't exercise enough." - n

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Fedaykin

Joined: May 11
Posts: 72

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 10:37
Like I said eKatherine. The complexity is in the details of making sure calories in is less than calories out. If you figure those two numbers out and a way to stick to it (which pretty much everyone agrees is difficult and made harder with modern bad ideas like processed food), you are *guaranteed* to lose weight and keep it off.

No doubt, however, that doing that in the modern world is _very_ hard to accomplish for many people.

jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 11:54
Oh how i hate the simplistic perfect world view of calories in against calories out.... Perfect world with perfect people...wish i lived there as everything is so simple
Fedaykin

Joined: May 11
Posts: 72

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 12:16
jonnybadback wrote:
Oh how i hate the simplistic perfect world view of calories in against calories out.... Perfect world with perfect people...wish i lived there as everything is so simple


It's not necessarily simple to accomplish (it can be really hard to correctly determine calories out and even harder to maintain the necessary discipline), but is a fact.

You can't fool physics.
jduke85

Joined: Jan 12
Posts: 3

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 13:01
eKatherine wrote:
The fact is we keep hearing messages that you can lose weight without being hungry and without working hard. It's understandable that people would believe them.


I will grant this idea some merit:

When the average person is bombarded with infomercials, internet ads, tv commercials, and magazine ads that say it's easy, it's no work at all, with this device/daily pill/super juice/magic shake/engineered equipment/etc "you TOO can LOSE weight! LOSE 57 lbs an hour!*" (*exaggeration) - of course very few succeed at losing weight, and of course, very few want to believe that it is, actually, work, but that it's a relatively simple process. The brain has been essentially brainwashed into believing that there is some secret trick or product that skinny/fit people aren't telling them about.

The reality is? Sometimes, you're (general you) going to be hungry. Sometimes, you're going to not want to go train. But all of this talk of basically defying the laws of physics because of "mystery elements!!eleventy!" is almost disordered thinking.

The law of thermodynamics is simple: energy out must be greater than energy in. It's a very easy equation that equals weight loss.

The reality is, according to numerous studies, most people overestimate their caloric intake - some by a LOT. Most people overestimate their activity level. Most people follow what the treadmill says they've burned off, which is hardly ever correct.

I know it's beating a dead horse, but it's science. Calories in - Calories out. There is no magic food or secret tricks.
jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

      quote  
Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 13:31
Fedaykin wrote:
jonnybadback wrote:
Oh how i hate the simplistic perfect world view of calories in against calories out.... Perfect world with perfect people...wish i lived there as everything is so simple


It's not necessarily simple to accomplish (it can be really hard to correctly determine calories out and even harder to maintain the necessary discipline), but is a fact.

You can't fool physics.


You can fool your physics with biology... Genetics and meds... Now that is fact
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,266

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 20:16
And then on the other hand, what if it's all been a big fat lie?
Diablo360x

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 781

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 21:05
You figure out your daily burn by repeatedly counting calories and monitoring weight. Eventually you will have a very good idea of your average burn as long as your activities do not fluctuate vastly from week to week you will have a good idea of your maintenance. This very site will give you a great baseline and you can lower or raise calories ingested depending on progress. From there, simply eat 20% less calories than your maintenance or more if you're trying to gain. The math is simple. The journey is the hard part for many. Stressors, family get together, etc, can all get in the way. There are hurdles but as long as you're counting all calories 24/7 and making sure you're in an overall deficit, you WILL reach your goals.
Love your food or risk failure. No quick fixes, this is a lifestyle change. No extremes are needed just consistency.
Diablo360x

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 781

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 21:11
jonnybadback wrote:

You can fool your physics with biology... Genetics and meds... Now that is fact


Aren't most people on meds on them for life or until they get healthier? Even on meds, you can do what I mentioned above. You can still eventually figure out your maintenance calories. I've never heard of someone's genetics making their metabolisms swing up and down so it applies to people with even the worst genes as well.
Love your food or risk failure. No quick fixes, this is a lifestyle change. No extremes are needed just consistency.
Spacey47

Joined: Apr 12
Posts: 916

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Posted: 20 Dec 2012, 23:24
jonnybadback wrote:
Spacey that is a real broad brush you are painting people with. Are you basing your comments on your own experiences. Are you blaming your parents as to why you put weight on as a child and that as an adult you did not have the intelligence to make your own life choices.

As a child i was slim. We got exercise at school. We ate food that needed to be cooked. As an adult i ate when i was hungry and could easily go a day without food but i also ate socially. The reason i put weight on was due to an injury

which meant my lifestyle became sedentary. it was nothing to do with my parents or lifestyle. I made the choice to change. I made the thought process.


Who said I was heavy as a child?


Do you just make up nonsense about people to fit your own agenda?

I have generally been pretty fit my whole life but in the last few years I let my weight slip in my mid forties.


I am now sub 10% bf with a 30 inch waist so I think I have demonstrated the ability and intelligence to re shape myself..... how are you doing?


Most intelligent people including dieticians, nutrisionists say that the eating habits we learn as children has a strong influence on how we eat as adults.


I really wish you would just STOP TROLLING my posts you are like a stalker


jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 04:00
Spacey i am not trolling but you raised the comment. I merely asked what you based your evidence on. I agree most nutitionists say our habits are learnt as children. Mine wasn't. Based on what you say wasn't. So you shouldn't just say what you did as it wasn't fact. By the way my bmi is normal. My bf is 16%. My visceral fat is normal and my waist is 31" but i am not sure that is relevant.
Spacey47

Joined: Apr 12
Posts: 916

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 13:47
There is nothing in my post that you are quoting that is based on my direct personal experience, i am merely observing the world as i see it.

as a child we always ate home cooked meals, played for hours in the park and ice cream sweets and biscuits were a TREAT not a daily occurance.


now i see kids eating pizza and mcdonalds everyday, drinking fizzy pop all the time and eating sweets sitting on thir bums playing computer games.

my son is 5 years old, the vast majority of his meals are home cooked from scratch, he eats fruit and veg and fresh meat and fish everyday

he plays non stop in the park and at home, he eats loads of healthy food but he has a super lean shape from all his activity

i am hoping to be setting him an example and eating habits that will help keep him healthy for life

your comments about my 'intelligence' are designed to be deliberately provocative and irritating and that is as good as a description of trolling as can be found
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,266

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 14:16
Spacey, it sounds like you were only a little overweight for a few years in your life. Your experiences simply do not make you an expert on weight control.
Gratefull

Joined: May 11
Posts: 13

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 15:20
Spacey, your so right on its not even funny. People have a hard time reconciling their actions and the results that will inevitable come. If you break down being overweight into such simple terms it rattles people's minds and takes away their long held excuses. Have you ever watched survivor on T.V.? Its amazing that when you have little or no food you drop weight. Its so simple but if we accept that fact then we just burden ourselves with the idea that it really does come down to your hand and mouth. Control that and you have won the game. Easier said than done for most folks. In fact I would go so far as to say that people like the idea of being on a diet just so they can say they are trying. Of course you can never try...you can either do it or not. There is no concept of trying...the act of trying implicates the action that is "doing".
Alright, getting down off my soapbox now. Happy Holidays~
jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 15:32
Spacey you always comment on the forums based on your experiences and opinions against others comments. They are emotive and provoking. Which is the definition of trolling on forums. You call everyone who replies to your comments a troll which is the pot calling the kettle black.

I commend and respect you on how you are trying to bring your boy up. I also commend and respect how you have lost weight and maintained it. However i can't respect that you are closed to being challenged and resort to calling names when you dislike a reply.
Spacey47

Joined: Apr 12
Posts: 916

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 15:59
Have a look back every time I post you post directly after me commenting on what I say in some pathetic attempt to twist what I say.

Thats trolling why don't you do us both a favour and not comment on what I say.......simple isnt it


Spacey47

Joined: Apr 12
Posts: 916

      quote  
Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 16:05
eKatherine wrote:
Spacey, it sounds like you were only a little overweight for a few years in your life. Your experiences simply do not make you an expert on weight control.


So you have to be grossly overweight for years to be one?

People over complicate this I have been overweight because I ate too much and moved too little. Reversing this has resolved the issue.

I dont claim to be an expert but I have successfully controlled my weight following the only scientifically proven method ot doing do. Burn more than you eat
jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 17:18
No i commented on things that there are two sides to. You just like to call names to get emotions running which is trolling. You could do us both a favour and just don't comment at all and stop commenting that you have the magic answer to everything... To coin your phrasing
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,266

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 19:24
It's a good thing that 250 million overweight or obese Americans have Spacey to tell them the problem is they're lazy gluttons. That should fix the problem of obesity in America.
paperiniko

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 343

      quote  
Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 03:46
eKatherine wrote:
It's a good thing that 250 million overweight or obese Americans have Spacey to tell them the problem is they're lazy gluttons. That should fix the problem of obesity in America.


well that might be an harsh way to put it but it is undoubtedly true that the obesity epidemic is due to the fact that for various reasons, sociological, economic, demographic etc, people in most countries and particularly in USA have lost control of calorie balance because they eat more and exercise less, that's the reality than you can dress it up as you wish according to your particular interests and or inclinations, but that is the basic reason.
The one thing that will never cease to amaze me whenever I travel to the US is the size of portions which is ridiculous with meals that very easily go over 2-3k calories in some places.
There is no way that the average person can maintain an healthy weight by eating this way no matter how much exercise she/he can reasonably do.
Spacey47

Joined: Apr 12
Posts: 916

      quote  
Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 16:14
eKatherine wrote:
It's a good thing that 250 million overweight or obese Americans have Spacey to tell them the problem is they're lazy gluttons. That should fix the problem of obesity in America.


Quote where I have called Americans 'lazy gluttons'



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