Resting Metabolism Rate

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rhuff02

Joined: Apr 12
Posts: 1

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Posted: 14 Dec 2012, 10:44
I went for the test yesterday and found out that my RMR is very low. Does anyone else have this situation? I was put on a 1100 calorie lifestyle change.
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

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Posted: 14 Dec 2012, 10:48
What is a "lifestyle change"? Is that the number of calories you will be eating from now on for maintenance, or is it a weight loss level?

When I reach my goal I will keep counting calories until I have figured out my true metabolic rate.
lkramer44

Joined: Sep 12
Posts: 4

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Posted: 14 Dec 2012, 22:07
How do they test for that? I have musculas dystrophy and have very very little muscle mass. I wish I could find some way of finding out how many calories I need to eat....I have great will power and thats more than half the battle.
paperiniko

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 343

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Posted: 15 Dec 2012, 00:56
I think the estimate is based on the estimate of lean body mass
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

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Posted: 15 Dec 2012, 11:14
The most accurate way to do it is to record everything you eat while keeping your calorie intake constant, then adjust over a period of weeks if you lose or gain. Everything else is an estimate based on most people.

Keep in mind that if you are overweight, a lot of estimates are based on your current weight as though you were lean at that weight. Fat does not raise your metabolic rate nearly as much as lean muscle mass does. The fact is that the number that should be used is our target weight plus 20% of the excess fat we are carrying. As you lose weight, it will adjust down.
NCNOLE

Joined: Feb 11
Posts: 1,218

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Posted: 15 Dec 2012, 14:05
Start exercising, build muscle and see what happens. Re-test in 6 months to see if that number will increase. But I think those numbers are fairly accurate. I had my body fat tested through bod pod method at local university and I am hoping to re-test in January and hopefully that number will be better since I increased my weight training. I had my BMR tested probably 12 years ago and it was around 1700, but I was 25 at the time! It decreases as you age Sad
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

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Posted: 16 Dec 2012, 17:41
I went through my diet calendar and saw I had 20 days of food data. I subtracted to find out how much weight I had lost in that time, then multiplied that by 3500 calories per pound. By adding that to the calories I had eaten during that time, I found my BMR to be 2000 calories a day.
paperiniko

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 343

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Posted: 17 Dec 2012, 01:22
if I understand correctly your process that would not be your BMR though, but rather the average calorie consumption unless you also took into account your activities burn out.

In any case there are formula to calculate BMR based on LBM and Body Fat, they are not 100% accurate but no method or tool is and in any case they are more than enough to have a point of reference for calorie budget, alternatively there are a few body monitors that are fairly accurate. I use Body Media which I find really helpful, but there are others
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

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Posted: 17 Dec 2012, 06:18
My average calorie consumption based on my present level of activity, which I expect to continue. I consider this to be enlightening and useful, unlike my general impression, which was way off, or some number generated by a calculator online, which would be not based on any real indicators of my own body and would have to be taken on faith.
Toddcodish

Joined: Sep 11
Posts: 3

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Posted: 21 Dec 2012, 14:44
Sorry, but the most accurate way is to get an expired air test (same machine that does Vo2 testing) to figure either your RMR or BMR (they differ slightly) This is achieved by going early in the morning to have the machine hooked up to your mouth with a simple tube inserted and your nose blocked with a small, padded clip. You then just lay still and breathe and relax for about 12 minutes. This measures (after inputting all the pertinent information) your air intake and carbon dioxide discharge.

You can do many tests in a 'field' manner, such as heart rate and pace for swimming, running and cycling, but the RMR/BMR caloric consumption test is a hard one to get an accurate figure out of without a machine. Many folks do this type of testing; I am a triathlon coach and do this along with Vo2 & blood lactate for performance data as well as caloric consumption at work, i.e. you burn 145 calories per hour at 120BPM (beats per minute) while cycling, or you burn 359 calories per hour while running at 158BPM. You can also tell what energy system the calories are primarily coming from, i.e. fat (oxidation) carbs (glycolisis), etc.

Feel free to email me if I can help you out.
toddcodish@gmail.com

Good luck!
-T

PS-I am in the Dallas area if you are local and would like to consider testing with me and my company (www.triplethreattough.com)
paperiniko

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 343

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Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 03:37
yes that is probably true but in my opinion for most people that level of accuracy is not necessary. The estimate you get via online calculators adjusted with a month of body weight monitoring is more than enough to set a calorie budget.
Besides the RMR will change continuously based on weight and LBM so it is better to have a tool that you can use at home whenever you weigh in
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

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Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 08:21
The inaccuracy of the exercise calculations they use here means that any estimation of the calories we are using during our exercise is only a wild guess. I lift a lot of weight but not as many different exercises as people who use machines, and my calorie requirement is 100 calories above my theoretical RDI. I could say how long my workouts last, but people who lift weights rest between sets. There is only one figure given under weight lifting, and we have no way of knowing what sort of workout that "moderate" refers to or how to adjust.
Toddcodish

Joined: Sep 11
Posts: 3

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Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 16:47
paperiniko, RMR will not change significantly enough to alter calories by more than 10-20 calories in a short time. It takes quite a while and major changes to move the number too much. I assure you, 3 RMR tests per year and you would not miss a beat! And, eKatherine, it's true measuring caloric consumption of a particular modality is unique in that modality, you could still get an average HR to confirm a much, much better of caloric consumption while lifting.
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

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Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 18:14
I don't try to get cardio out of my weight workouts. If I want cardio, I do cardio.
Toddcodish

Joined: Sep 11
Posts: 3

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Posted: 22 Dec 2012, 18:22
Also, let me throw in my two cents about nutrition; I am a triathlon coach and triathlete of 25 years (next year) and I have seen the terrible, terrible convoluted information that is put out there. Not that it's all crap, it's just confusing, ever changing and well, no perfect answers. While I truly believe in somotypes (endomorph, ectomorph, etc) or "people are different" the one thing Dr Phil Maffatone taught me was carbohydrate intolerance. That said, Dr Sears, Atkins and the like, have some semblance of truth in what's wrong with what we eat. Bob Seebohar refers to it as metabolic efficiency. Dr Peter Attia,M.D. does this interview with Ben Greenfield and talks about ketosis. I love it. I am not practicing it (considering it) Dr Attia pronounces that he believes he learned improper information about nutrition in school (Stanford, Johns Hopkins) that they were WRONG. Listen to this podcast if you are interested in a good overview, albeit a bit techy at times! http://www.bengreenfieldfitness.com/2012/04/exercise-on-low-carbohydrate-diet/
paperiniko

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 343

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Posted: 23 Dec 2012, 02:44
Ekatherine I think you keep confusing BMR with total calorie consumption. BMR is your basic metabolic rate and does not include your activities. In my experience the algorithm to estimate BMR based on age, LBM etc is quite accurate and not far off the measurement done by more sophisticated tests.

With regards to activities I agree with you that the calorie consumption reported by online calculators are rough estimates because they depend on a lot of personal variables. I found that a good solution is to use body monitors which have a better aproximation, but it is also possible to do it via a trial and error process. The only problem with it is that calorie consumption for similar activities varies over time when you drop weight so it needs readjustment, that is why body monitors are convenient
jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

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Posted: 23 Dec 2012, 08:53
Paperiniko i would be very interested in the algorithm to work it out. I only use FS as a guide for calories whether its in or out
paperiniko

Joined: Jul 11
Posts: 343

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Posted: 23 Dec 2012, 09:11
you can find the formulas of different ones here:
http://www.freedieting.com/calorie_needs.html
or just input your data in here
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/tools/bmr-calculator (It uses the Mifflin-St Jeor formula).

Again these are for the BMR and do not take into account your activity level that must be added up on top and can vary a lot depending on individuals and obviously on you daily activity
jonnybadback

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 321

      quote  
Posted: 23 Dec 2012, 10:37
Cheers i will have a go at it and see what results i get
eKatherine

Joined: Aug 12
Posts: 1,286

      quote  
Posted: 23 Dec 2012, 10:47
paperiniko wrote:
Ekatherine I think you keep confusing BMR with total calorie consumption.


No. Given that I am keeping my activities more or less constant, this is a useful measure to me. BMR would be utterly useless. Spending thousands of dollars a year to come up with theoretical data I would have to pay a trainer to interpret (using only educated guesswork themselves) would be less useful to me, but highly useful to the bottom line of the trainer.

There really is no way anyone can give more than a rough guesstimate as to the number of calories I burn during the workouts I do each week. Scientifically speaking, the least accurate number in a formula is the one that controls the accuracy of the end result. It doesn't matter how accurate your BMR has been measured if you've got a wild guess on how many calories your workouts are burning.

Some people like to vary their workouts so much they they can never tell how they are doing based on previous weeks' data. But people like that generally don't keep data anyway.

I am not one of those people. I like to see how I am improving from week to week. Or not, in which case I would make changes in my workout of diet.

If you could show me data that demonstrates that lifting the same workout sets and reps while only adding weight as my max increases produces drastic fluctuations in calories consumed, I probably wouldn't change anything, because that would mean that I was just using more calories and probably losing more quickly. I seriously doubt that my workouts are getting easier and I burn fewer calories as I increase the weight I lift, though you are free to show me studies on that (don't forget I am a 57 year old woman when you go looking for research on powerlifters at my age and gender).

Given that my body's calorie demand is higher than the fatsecret theoretical demand (which many people say is already too high), I think it is reasonable to attribute that discrepancy to my weight lifting.

How many people are being held back from what they know they need to do by the perceived need to have an expert tell them to do it?

But then, when I felt like coffee was making me sick, I didn't go to the doctor to ask whether I should give up coffee. I gave up coffee.



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